#351 The Founder of Rolex: Hans Wilsdorf

0:00 The book that I'm gonna talk to you about today is nearly impossible to find. It was first published in nineteen forty six. There's only a thousand copies ever made. It's called Rolex Jubilee and then the Subtitle is actually in Latin, but when you translate it from Latin into English, it literally means Go with me.

0:15 And so it's a tiny four volume like history of Rolex and volume one was written by Hans Wilsdorf, who is the founder of Rolex. And so he tells

0:26 The founding story of Rolex in his own words. There's a lot of things that'll surprise you in this story. The first one being that he was a sole shareholder of Rolex. But the second one was that he was an orphan. So he goes right into his early life. And in one sentence he sets the entire stage for us. He says, I was born on march twenty second, eighteen eighty one. My mother's early death.

0:45 was soon followed by that of my father's. And at age twelve I was an orphan. And there's a decision made by his uncles that is gonna change the trajectory of Hans's entire life. They decide to sell the family business to pay for boarding school. for the kids that are left behind. She said my mother's brother's

1:03 decided it'd be wiser to liquidate the prosperous business, which had belonged first to my grandfather and then later to my father. Believing That in this way we children could be better prepared for life without having to call upon anyone for help. His life would have been very different without his uncles and that decision to actually liquidate the business and then take that money and actually send him to boarding school, which I'll get into why that's so important for the founding of Rolex in one second. But he talks a little bit about the fact that one of the best things his uncles ever did for him and his siblings was that they taught him self reliance.

1:30 Keep in mind. The words I'm reading you, Hans is writing them. He is in his mid sixties. He's looking back at his life. And so he says our uncles were not indifferent to our fate. They made me become self reliant very early in life. Looking back, I believe.

1:46 That it is to this That much of my success is due. Now this part is really important. There's gonna be a few times where I'm gonna talk to you today. about things that happen early in Han's life he doesn't understand. So you and I talk about this over and over again.

1:58 the the idea that the world is a classroom. Like the the the books that you're reading, the knowledge and skills that you're acquiring. The relationships you're building, you have no idea. that the opportunities that they unlock in the future, you just can't possibly predict it. And so they're gonna put'em in a boarding school. So I'm gonna read this to you and then I'm gonna t say why this is uh so important to the founding of Rolex. Highly likely that

2:19 If he didn't learn all these languages at this boarding school. That there wouldn't have been a role X, or his his career definitely would have been vastly different. I'll explain why in one second. So it says we're placed in a boarding school of excellent repute. Where we received that sound education so necessary to the man who has to make his own way in the world. I showed a particular liking for mathematics and languages. The languages is so important. And this inclination drove me to travel and work in foreign countries. So

2:44 This education in multiple languages. I would argue is maybe the basis for his entire career. It will lead directly to his discovery of the opportunity on which his life and career will then be devoted to. And it happens relatively early in his life because At the age of nineteen, he Hans is gonna start working in the watch industry at nineteen. And he will do so for the next six sixty years.

3:05 Until his death. Now, when I say it's the watch industry, this is the thing that blew my mind because everybody knows the brand Rolex. Without a doubt, one of the most valuable brand names in existence, right? But there was no such thing as a wristwatch industry for men at the time that Hans's When he's nineteen years old.

3:21 This is the most one of the most shocking things about me doing re doing all this reading and research. It's one I've been repeating all week to To friends that I've been telling about Hans. And I believe it's to be one of the most inspiring parts of this entire story, and I'll go I'll go into that, but So at nineteen years old, right? He goes to this little city in Switzerland.

3:38 To g he has a job, he's gonna work. As an English correspondence And a clerk. With a Swiss company called Cuna Courten. Now watch how this all ties together. So

3:49 Cuna Court, it's a Swiss company. All they do is they export Swish pocket watches. The watch industry, like n ninety nine, maybe more than ninety nine percent of the watch industry at this time in history. Is pocket watches.

4:02 And so this company, they act as import agents. This is really important. S because he spoke, because at this point Hans speaks English, German, French. I think there's a other there's a few other languages that he actually speaks. He gets a job where he handles the business correspondence of this relatively large import agent for Swish. Watch. Manufacturers. This business is operating in a ton of different countries and a ton of different different languages. So this helps him get a a really good interstanding of international strategic marketing.

4:32 And I'm not sure there's a better form of education for a young person learning business. Like when I was reading this section, it it reminded me exactly of what like a young Rockefeller. So Hans is nineteen, where we are in the story. Rockefeller gets a job when he's like sixteen or seventeen for this produce commission firm. in Cleveland that's called Hewlett and Tuttle. And as a result of that job, Rockefeller learn so many valuable skills. He understands bookkeeping, he understands contracts, he's looking at shipping, he's learning about margins. He's learning skills that he's gonna use for his entire career once he starts building his own company.

5:02 And when you're in a position like Rockefeller was in Ohio or like Hans's is in Switzerland, like you can learn so fast. So in in the case of Hans, like he's gonna start working here at nineteen. By twenty five, he starts his own company. That that's the company it's gonna turn into Rolex. And so Hans describes his time of his life. He says it was a big concern exporting about one million francs worth of watches annually. All grades of watches were dealt with, although only a small proportion was manufactured by the firm itself. So I need to translate that for you. In the late eighteen hundreds, early nineteen hundreds. When the you hear the word concerned, we would call that a company today.

5:34 They would call what we would call product, they would call an article. So this import agents business for Swiss watch manufacturers was a pretty big business, is what he's saying. And the next sentence is why I said that decision made by his uncles to educate him to send him to the to the best school. That school teaches him multiple languages is why he the the opportunity to found and develop Rolex was unlocked many years in the future. And he says my work there provided an excellent opportunity to study the watchmaking industry closely. And to examine every type of watch produced.

6:03 Both in Switzerland and abroad. So a few years later, he's going to switch to another firm and move to London. And this is what he said about this time. And he's only gonna last two years before he starts his own company. Two things struck me most forcibly, that's an interesting writing, most forcibly about my new employers. On one hand, their commercial competence. And on the other hand, their lack of specialization.

6:23 And now looking back after having done all this other additional reading and research, that sentence is really important to me. Because he's talking about the the you know they're very commercially competent, right? Uh in other words, they have their shit together. They're running a great business. Hans will do the same, but then he says their lack of specialization. So this is something I've been talking about nonstop this week. That is frankly very inspiring to me, and you see it over and over again in the stories. I think that's why reading business biographies is far superior than reading just business books. Because in every single life of an entrepreneur You like grope your way to what you're doing.

6:52 There's all these like false starts, dead ends. You can just see as you go through not only Hans's life, but everybody's life. It's just like they're trying to f they figure it out a little bit along the way. And they also ape and copy, right? People that became before them, experiences they had before them. So when he starts out, this is a the the one of the most inspiring things because like Rolex is so unbelievably focused today.

7:14 They know what they're great at and they focus relentlessly on them. But in the very beginning, Hans had no idea. And what I mean by that is he had, you know, I don't know, fifteen different brand names. He wasn't making watches at all. He was just reselling them. He was really a gifted marketer, which I'll get to in a minute. When you think about lack of specialization, is this like their focus on luxury Lorelic's function f focus on

7:34 Luxury watches. He was selling cheap watches, you know, midgrade watches, really expensive watches. He is constantly experimenting. using that action as a form of im uh education, right? It gives him information back, and then you see him adjust slowly over time. And it is through that process that he uncovers or discovers. This phenomenal opportunity.

7:54 And this is when he describes founding the company that's gonna turn into Rolex. I soon gain confidence in myself. And in nineteen oh five, at the age of twenty four, I decided to set up in business. Feeling that my training and education had prepared me to stand on my own. And so he starts this company called Wilsdorf and Davis and he says they had mu we had modest capital at our disposal. So

8:15 Will this is fascinating too. About the again, this this constant iteration that you see throughout the life of Hans Willsdorf. So Wilsdorf and Davis was n they were not watch manufacturers. They purchased watches from Swish manufacturers. Think about his experience that he had. He worked for two firms that did exactly this. Oh, I can do this too, right? Let me draw another analogy to Rockefeller. Did Rockefeller jump from Hewitt and Tuttle, this Produce Commission House, into standard oil? No. What did he do? He quit and started his own produce commission house. And then that opportunity led him to this accidental discovery of realizing, hey, I can actually become one of the first. Oil refiners.

8:47 So again. This is fascinating. So Wilsdorf and Davis they're not watch manufacturers. They purchase watch watches from the Swish watch makers, right? From Swish. I keep saying Swish. I don't know why I'm adding an a and H on there. From Swiss. Manufacturers and then would sell them to retailers. But I love this idea where he starts Oh, he's just got an office, he's got no money, so what are you gonna do?

9:08 Like you can't make'em yourself, you just gotta sell them. When they're talking about they're importing watches, they're talking about pocket watches. If you only remember one thing from this episode, the only one thing is it's like the power of belief. the the reason the Rolex is what it is today, the reason that we're talking about Hans, you know, what, eighty years after he died, something like that. It's because his belief This belief in the wristwatch for men, which did not exist when he started believing in it.

9:32 Hans is a huge collector of pocket watches, which I think is also important. He's working in the industry, he collects pocket watches. When you collect something, when you see something, you see its flaws and you see what should be improved. You see that with the way Hans was thinking about developing a new market for wristwatches because he saw the the deficiency Of the pocket watch industry'cause he was he was so intimately involved in it. And so He's describing

9:54 what the state of this industry was when he was twenty four years old when he started his first company. So at this period The wristlett watch. So this is hilarious. They do not call'em wrist watches, right? They called them either wristlet watches They would also call them bracelet watches.

10:08 And the reason they call him Brace Watch is because At this time, only women Would wear Wrist watches. And so he talks about this. The fact was

10:17 For men, the wrist watch or the bracelet watch was an object of derision. The idea of wearing a watch on one's wrist was at this time thought contrary to the conception of masculinity. One guy remarked that he wouldn't be caught doing such an unrefined thing, meaning wearing a watch on his wrist. He said You'd be likely to catch him in a dress. as you would to be wearing a wristlet.

10:40 And this sentence says everything prior to World War One Wrist watches for men did not exist. That blew my mind. Prior to World War One, wrist watches for men didn't exist. And the reason that people uh the men in World War One in uh war Uh wristwatches.

10:54 They were known as trench watches, and they did that so they could coordinate movement on the battlefield. That is the very beginning of the wristwatch industry for men. And so Hans talks about the fact that hey, you know, of course, if the public is skeptical, then of course existing players in the industry are gonna be skeptical. I think this is why it's so important that he was uh somebody young. Usually people younger coming into industry say

11:16 They see all the things that all the flaws that they could fix. Which says watchmakers all over the world remain skeptical. As to its possibilities, meaning the wristwatch for men. And believe that this new fangled object was bound to prove a failure. Their argument against the risk. Watch.

11:29 were the following, and they're legitimate arguments. These are essentially the way I'm w you would think about what he's describing here. It's something you and I've talked about over and over again, that problems are just opportunities and workflows. Business is problems. So the best companies are just effective problem solving machines. And so they're like, no, you have all these pro unsolved problems. First, the mechanism required by this type of watch Must of necessity be small and delicate. And could therefore never withstand the violent gestures of the hand and arm. Second. Dust and water would rapidly spoil the mechanism. He's gonna solve that problem too.

11:59 Third, accuracy. And regularity of working could never be attained with such small so small of a movement. That's a third problem that he is going to solve. Back to Hans. In spite of all of this, I kept my faith. In the wristlet watch. And was determined to see what could be done. Now this is the crazy thing. So he's writing that as a sixty five year old man.

12:20 I found A quote. We need thirty three. In nineteen fourteen, this guy really believed in this. He says my personal opinion is that the pocket watches will almost completely disappear.

12:31 And that wrist watches will replace them definitively. I am not mistaken in this opinion, and you will see that I am right. That is insane. He's thirty-three years old when he's saying that. So he says the task I undertook meant the overcoming of enormous difficulties. He just laid out all the problems. that were preventing other people from doing this. And yet today, after forty years of striving.

12:52 It seems to me that I have surmounted them. And I believe that in doing so I've contributed to the development of the watch m watch making industry in general. And then it gets even more fascinating because then you could tell he he he's thinking like an entrepreneur You know, he wanted to build wealth. As you can imagine, an orphan wanting to do so, right?

13:09 And so we Such a he he identifies like well this pocket watch The pocket watching. industry is never gonna grow because how are we using it? P at the time pocket watches

13:19 We're passed down from Father to son. Then from son to grandson. And they're also hidden in your pocket. And Hans is looking at this is like, this is a big problem. And so what he realized is like if if he could take it out of the pocket and put it on your wrist

13:33 Right, there's gonna be w more wear and tear, but you're also gonna see it. So he says The wristwatch was bound to bring about a certain revolution in the industry. it would have to cause an increase in sales, not only on account of its novelty. But also because by its very nature. It called for more frequent renewal.

13:49 More exposure to damage than the pocket watch. That is actually really shrewd observation. It's just like, well, you're gonna buy one pocket watch and it's gonna last for a hundred years. No one sees it. it's protected, of course this uh this industry is gonna be so much smaller than the wristwat industry could be if we can just convince men

14:08 Damn wrist watches. And then he also had like this shrewd insight to human uh nature and human psychology because you know it's hidden in your y you don't see the product being used. But now if I break take that product that that was hidden in your coat and I put it on your watch, what happens? Becomes a fashion accessory.

14:24 And so People see it. It helps the product spread. And so he says the wristwatch is the type of product Of which each individual likes to have not only one but several. And then this may be the most important

14:37 sentence I read from Hans or about Hans because This is just an incredible sentence. Because Hans had The highest order bit. that other people in the watch industry didn't and that was belief

14:51 And this is what he said, I had very early realized the manifold possibilities of the wristwatch. And feeling sure that they would materialize in time. I resolutely went on my way. Rolex. was thus able to get several years ahead.

15:05 of other watch manufacturers Who persisted In clinging. To the pocket watch. As their chief

15:12 Product. This is something that cannot be skipped over. So Steve Jobs had this idea, and I heard him say it right before he died. This is like two years before he died. He was giving this interview. Think he was on stage with Bill Gates, if I remember correctly. But he talked about the highest order bit.

15:28 And so I actually had to look that up. What did that mean when I heard Steve said it? And it's he's he's refer he's using a computer reference. He says in computing, The highest order bit. Also called the most significant bit is the bit position in a binary number having the greatest value. And so in Steve's case, what he's talking about on stage is the fact that. You gotta love what you're doing, you gotta have passion because if you're doing anything that's worthwhile, it's so Difficult.

15:49 that if you don't love it, you don't have passion, you're gonna quit because The people that quit doing things they don't love. They're sane people. And that this love and passion for what you're doing can make you i in some ways irrational. And that irrationality is rewarded because you just don't give up. You have this like dogged determination. So I understand who am I gonna to argue with Steve.

16:08 But I don't know I obviously believe that I'm like completely obsessed with what I'm doing, but I think actually the highest order bit It's belief. It's belief in yourself and it's belief in your idea. And in Hans's story, that's certainly the case. It wasn't passion and love. It was belief that he saw an opportunity and he was willing to pursue it and to actually change. The entire industry.

16:29 And you know what I thought of when I read this section? The first thing this I mean, this happened instantaneously too, which is fascinating, because this is one of the most important things. I thought of this paragraph in Ted Turner's autobiography. This is episode three twenty seven. And It's just remarkable because Ted is looking at the landscape, right? He's he's like, I'm going to make the world's first twenty four hour News network.

16:51 That idea led him to become a billionaire, but he's analyzing this. He's like, Wait, I don't understand this. Why am I seeing the opportunity that no one else is? And so this is from this is the paragraph that I thought of when I was reading this. Hans describing the opportunity that he saw. And this is Ted Turner writing in his autobiography. Clearly the companies for whom the economics of a twenty four hour news network would have made the most sense were the big three broadcasters, right? So ABC, CBS, NBC. Why?

17:16 Because they already had most of what was needed. They had studios, they had bureaux, they had reporters. They had anchors. They had almost everything but a belief in cable. Ted Turner.

17:28 had the highest order bit. He didn't have a studio, he didn't have the bureaus, he didn't have the reporters, he didn't have the anchors, he'd have to go and collect and build that. But he had something they didn't. He had a belief in cable. And the crazy thing is like there's a great description of this. I gotta read this story because it's it's hilarious. Ted Turner's thirty eight years old when this story happens.

17:48 And this guy interviewed in his autobiographies saying that they just happen to wind up being uh on a plane together. They wind up uh sitting next to each other. And he says as soon as we get airborne, Ted pulls out a copy of the Delta lines. Delta Airlines magazine. He turns to the map United States and starts explaining how he's gonna become a billionaire. And he quotes Ted here, goes, Make sure you buy my stock, I'm going to be a billionaire and why? And he just lays out this entire thing.

18:10 And then the story ends perfectly. He says his enthusiasm was so genuine and so infectious. that I'll never forget it. So go back to that. This is I what what a sentence. I had very early realized the manifold possibilities of the wristwatch. and feeling sure that they would materialize in time. I resolutely went on my way. Rolex was thus able to get several years ahead.

18:29 of other watch manufacturers who persisted in clinging to the pocket watch as their chief product If I remember correctly. Ted Turner had like eleven year head start on everybody else. It's absurd. Okay, so how does he start acting on this belief? I think one thing that's important to understand the story of Hans Willsdorf. Is the fact that he understood the opportunity better than anybody else.

18:48 And he would invest heavily in developing the technology that he needed to bring it to fruition. And so again, it goes back to this idea that the whole world is a classroom, that you never know how your previous experience, the things that you're learning will be used in the future. This you know, knowledge, skills, relationships, all these things compound. So You know, years before he founds his own company. He's working at that. firm in Switzerland and he hears about this guy named Herman Egler.

19:11 And Hermann's innovation that he made in nineteen oh two was These movements that you need inside of a watch. He made movements that would work in smaller Watches. And so Hans is going to learn this many years before he's able, he has actually the company to actually use it. But he says my interest had been roused.

19:27 But it's innovation. As the mechanism created by Aegler, right? had proved very successful from a technical point of view. As well as being accessible in price. So then after founding my firm in nineteen oh five

19:40 I go and place an order with Egler. This was the first step forward in our climb to success. So I need to bring There's a bunch of other things I read. Uh to to prepare for this podcast. Uh I'll leave all of them linked down below.

19:53 I pulled out a bunch of different books. Uh, but this podcast my friend Patrick did It's one of the best business podcasts I've ever heard in my life. I don't even know how many times I've listened to it now. It is an episode of business breakdowns. I will link it down below, but if you just go in your podcast player, look for business breakdowns and then search, just search Rolex. It has a great name too. Rolex. Timeless Excellence. My friend Patrick interviewed Ben Climber. Ben's the founder of Hodinky. He got access back in like 2015. He's one of the first people Roblex because they're super, super secretive. But he was one of the first people to actually go and tour all of their four manufacturing uh facilities. So he wrote this fantastic article.

20:26 That I also re read. And then uh he talks a lot about the history of Rolex and then how they operate today. But the reason I need to bring this up is because Agler is a very important name in the history of Rolex. From the very start of Rolex, Egler's actually the one manufacturing the watches. That were sold as Rolex watches.

20:41 Buying these movements from Egler is what Hans describes. It's his very first step forward in our clients' success. Now, the crazy thing, the reason I bring this up is because I also love Like an old school keep your word mentality. So Hans and the founder of Egler had a handshake deal. For seventi years. And the deal was that Aegler would make movements solely for Rolex, and when they say

21:04 There's a great line in the the podcast episode when he's like When I say an actual handshake deal, I mean a handshake deal. There was nothing on paper. There was nothing in writing all the way up until two thousand four when Rolex finally buys. Egler. Undoubtedly, undoubtedly at that point in two thousand four, Rolex is already making selling you know billions of dollars worth of watches. That's nuts.

21:27 And I just love that, you know, too. founders of companies coming together and say, Hey, we're gonna work together. I'm a man of my word. We're gonna seal this with a handshake. And that relationship and agreement was unbroken for seven decades. That's one of the coolest things I've ever heard. And so Hans is going to describe so you have the manufacturing and the making of Rolex watches are what's going to be sold under Rolex brand, which I haven't even got there yet. It's going to happen in Switzerland. He's still in London.

21:50 So d the design and the sales is separate from the manufacturing. And so he would travel from London to Switzerland several times a year. And he says I would bring with my collaborators new and personal ideas demanding that they be realized. In this way hundreds of models. were conceived and launched.

22:05 All across the world. He's selling this again. This goes back to the world's entire classroom. You have no idea how you're gonna use all the the experience you have. Remember, he was He he worked for an importer. They were taking Swiss watches and sending them everywhere. So he's just doing the same thing now with his own products.

22:20 And as we'll see, he's a master marketer, which I'll get into in a minute, but he he's having immediate success. This is how both a new fashion and a great commercial success sprang. From an apparently foolhardy idea, he's referencing the fact that everybody around him thought he what he was doing was silly. Men are never gonna wear these watches. Soon we were placing orders for tens of thousands.

22:40 And to the uninformed must have appeared extremely audacious Young people, when I read that, I thought of one of my favorite things Winston Churchover did. He had a personal motto that he'd repeat. He would say aloud to himself. Always more audacity. Hans when a young man was no

22:56 He was at many things, but one of the things he was, he was definitely audacious. I love the idea. It's like these guys are crazy. They m they are extremely audacious young people. And so at this point I need to be clear about something. This is not Rolex. He's selling under a ton of different brand names. He's eventually gonna realize, hey, I don't wanna just be sit in the middle. Right, I don't want to be a mill man. I want like all the value creation is gonna be if I own my own brand. And he g this is what I meant about this like constant iteration, this trial and error. I'm gonna remain the brand names yeah, they're

23:23 Yeah. Fick terrible. And so at this point, pre you know, doubling down on this fantastic idea of Rolex, he hasn't discovered that yet. So what he's doing is like there's a bunch of other brand names that he's he's Experimenting with. He had this idea, this is hilarious too,'cause I was reading about this.

23:38 'Cause you know, Rolex isn't now, there's I don't even think there's such thing as a cheap Rolex, right? And so he had this idea, he's like, Well, I can supply a watch. For every pocket. And what that means is like let's say you can order, you know, if I'm making these numbers up, but like a five dollar watch or a hundred dollar watch or a two thousand dollar watch. It's like I wanna I'm gonna serve every single aspect of the market, which obviously they don't do anymore. This is h his

23:59 Iteration is like learning from experience. I thought he The the note of myself was actually made me choco'cause I've done a bunch of episodes on these uh the early automobile industry founders. And I go, Oh. Hans was GM General Motors before focusing in on Ferrari. Like that's the way I think about it.

24:15 And so listen to some of these brand names. I love this because I, you know, you've heard me struggle with naming stuff all the time. And think about last week Steve Jobs or the week before Steve Jobs thinking to call the iMac the Mac Man. Like it's just terrible ideas. So I I take solace and inspiration with the fact that like oh everybody struggles with this stuff. And so even, you know, Rolex is one of the best names I've ever heard, one of the best brands that's ever existed. And before that he had unicorn. Rollco.

24:40 Elvira. Roll Watchco. Falcon. Gen X. Lonex.

24:45 Rolex Rolexis. Lexus. Hawfax. And Wintex. He even used different variation on the Rolex name itself.

24:54 He had the Rolex Watch Company. He had the RWC Limited. And he would even combine Rolex with other brand names and i this again, this is where he just realized this is a fucking terrible idea. I'm trying to sell a uh every single price point on a watch. So uh there was one Marconi. named after the inventor of the radio. And so he had one called the Rolex Marconi.

25:15 And all that did was allow people to think that they're buying Rolex, but they're getting it at a cheaper price. And so it's through all this trial and error where where Hans realized, like, Oh, this is a terrible idea. I'm cannibalizing sales, like this doesn't make sense. I'm gonna focus. And so This is where in nineteen oh eight he's like okay I'm gonna have like one single brand name. and a brand that I can invest in in for the long term. So he says it was time to think of giving our watches a name of their own, a trade name. What we would call brand name.

25:37 A brand name which could be inscribed on the dials. I was well aware that unless I succeeded in making our watch known under its own name, that my prospects would be limited. He would just be a middleman, right? And so there's actually a letter that he wrote in nineteen fifty eight where he's talking about how he came up with Rolex. He had a series of traits that the name had to have and for it for him to select it. And so he said I needed a short name. It had to be five letters or less because it has to be.

26:04 able to fit. It has to look good on the actual watch. It has to be easy to pronounce in every language. It has to have a good ring to it and it has to be easy to remember. And so when I was thinking about this is like how great He did in selecting the name Rolex. If you listen to last week's episode about how Steve Jobs sold, one of the ideas, main ideas from how Steve Jobs communicated, how he sold his ideas to people was that If you can make them ideas easy to understand, then they're easy to spread.

26:27 Ideas that are easy to understand are easy to spread. And I think you see an echo of that idea with Hans naming and actually picking is like this is the brand that I'm gonna build and the one I'm gonna invest in for the rest of my life. So now that he has a name, he does something that's really, really smart. Again, it is very uncommon for watchmakers to advertise directly to the public. Not only does he do so, but he did the Rolex continues to do so. So he says, I decided to launch the Rolex trademark. By means of an intensive advertising campaign. This policy entail an annual expenditure of more than twelve thousand British pounds.

26:58 Not for one year alone, but But for several in succession. So I wanna go back to how important this is. I want to go back to that business breakdowns episode on Rolex called Timeless Excellence. So it says Rolex was effectively the first people to have real marketing dollars put behind a watch. Rolex did this in a concentrated way, and they have continued to do it in a way that is simply just unmatched by others in their industry.

27:20 Rolex has been the number one brand for watches in the United States historically speaking from the nineteen fifties to today. Now I want to fast forward way ahead in the story. many, many years after Hans died, because I think this this idea is so important and I'm gonna show where I've seen this idea, uh other people use this idea successfully as well in a different industry. Uh so go back to the transcript from this episode. Did The financial crisis of two thousand eight, all the other brands, the competitors

27:44 You know, Omega, Tag Hure, all these other the brands. That are quote competitors to Rolex. When the financial crisis happens in two thousand eight, they pull back on their marketing. Rolex did not. Rolex put the pedal down and it was really two thousand eight, two thousand nine, two thousand ten. Which really elevated Rolex in the United States to a level that it is today.

28:03 If you speak to them directly, meaning Rolex the company directly. They'll credit that period as a turning point for them in the US. Now, what is incredible is Izzy Sharp, who's the founder of four seasons. This is episode 184. Episode 184, if you haven't listened to it, you should. His autobiography is incredible. Is he sharp? Did the exact same

28:22 Thing. This is what he says in his autobiography, right? Founder of four seasons. It's tempting during a recession to cut back on consumer advertising. At the start of each each of the last three recessions, the growth of spending on such advertising has slowed by an average of twenty seven percent. But consumer studies of those recessions have showed that the companies that didn't cut their ads had in recovery

28:42 captured the most market share. It's exactly what happened with Rolex in 2008, 2009, 2010. We did not cut back on our ad budget. This is now a founder four seasons or game. We did not cut back on our ad budget. In fact we raised it. to gain brand recognition which continued advertising sustains. is much easier to sustain momentum. Then restart it. So think about how important that intuition was. It's like well, I'm starting a new name.

29:07 All these other watchmakers, they're not advertising. Like why don't we why? Why w when we advertise? It doesn't make sense. Ot other products are advertised, we should do that. And I'm gonna do an intensive this isn't the words you use. I'm gonna do an intensive advertising campaign. And not just this year. But several years in succession.

29:22 And then this is nuts. I know I keep saying that, because this whole story is nuts because It the industry today, in large part to the to what Hans and Rolex did is completely different. So at this time You have your own watch brand. But you don't have your own stores. So you're selling to retailers. At the time the watch brands don't have the names on the watches.

29:41 the retailers would buy the watches and put their name on it. And so Hans talks about being one of the first people like no no like I'm gonna sell you my I'm gonna wholesale my watch and you're gonna put my brand name on it, not yours. I think it was like a decade or a decade and a half, if I remember correctly, where he had to fight. So he said something like that. You know, for when I first started doing this, one out of six they would they would agree like one out of six watches could have my name on it. Then it was two out of six, then three out of six, and then finally five out of six. And insisting on doing this is actually really, really important because he also is a perfectionist and so he realizes like oh quality

30:13 I said in the Steve one of Steve Jobs episodes I just did that quality was his survival strategy. I would say for Hans was the exact same thing. He's determined to produce the best wish wristwatch possible and we'll go into how accurate and the ways He was they did really smart like marketing around that too. So he he thought that was the key to success. Like I just have to be the best possible And he's not going to be able to do that unless customers demand that they get a Rolex and not just same watch.

30:36 Which is just renamed by whatever shop they happen to be buying it from. And insisting that the name is seen because before the the the brand name could be seen inside the watch, but no one the the customers are not opening up the watches. And so th I think this idea is really, really important. I'm gonna read a summary of this entire session to you. He also realized that he would get better orders and more control over the wholesale price of his watches. If he could build up demand so that customers would go in the shop and ask for

30:59 and insist on a Rolex watch by name. By his branding and advertising campaigns. Hans effectively turned the tables on the retailers. No longer would he have to approach retailers. And asked him to stock his watches.

31:13 Customers would demand Rolex branded watches. And the retailers would have to come to him. So as you already know, I'm obsessed by these people that identify a handful handful of principle. They know what's important to their business and they just execute on those principles. They repeat them. for decades. And that's exactly what Rolex did. That's exactly what Hans did.

31:32 He had essentially three things that and it took him what I'm about to describe to you is gonna you know take Two decades maybe. to actually fulfill to the degree that he wanted to,'cause remember, he starts his company back in nineteen oh five. the first waterproof watch just wanna be one of his three tenants isn't gonna happen for twenty years after that. And I think another six years after that, to he gets to perpetual. So he has three things that he wants to he goes.

31:54 I want the watches to be precise, which he d he handles that product that problem first. Uh, number two, I want them to be waterproof. And number three, I want them to be self winding. And so the first thing he does is like okay, my watches again, he's a perfectionist. They have to be the best in the world. So he goes to Egler and he's like How can we improve the time keeping of the watches?

32:14 And one thing that Charlie Munger says in Poor Charlie's Dominac is that social proof is a form of leverage. And so what Hans does here is very smart. He insists, he goes to Aegler and he's like, Hey I want to get certificates of performance from independent testing establishments. And so these are actually like astronomical observatories. They'll test how good these pieces are at time keeping, essentially.

32:34 And so there is a letter that Hans writes to Egler in nineteen twelve. And he's like, Hey, we need to produce a wristwatch that's capable of achieving an observatory. Time keeping certificate. Two years later in nineteen fourteen. Aegler actually solves that problem for Hans. And so Rolex achieves the first class A certificate ever to be awarded by an observatory.

32:53 for a wrist watch. This is what Han says in his autobiography. Another red letter day the development of our firm was when a small Rolex wristwatch One a class certificate. At the famous Q observatory.

33:06 This was on july fifteenth, nineteen fourteen, and it was a day I shall never forget, and keep that in mind, he is writing uh about this fifty years later. And so the reason I brought up what Charlie Munger said is because he uses this social proof, right, saying I read a bun there's so there's so many fantastic uh ol old Rolex ads. that that were published when Hans was alive.

33:28 And if you look at them, like they a lot of their ads say like The first, the only. So they'll say like the world's first self winding watch. The world's first Waterproof wristwatch. Another ad I found that says the Rolex still remains the only wristwatch in the world to gain certificates at Q.

33:42 And so if you think about that insistence on this idea to get to become the first to get the certificate, what happens? That makes your ads more effective. It's one form of leverage stacked on another. People are busy if they're in the market for a wristwatch, right? They're they wanna have one that's most accurate. And guess what? There's only one brand in the world. That has proven it keeps it keeps time so precise that went that extra step to get it tested to get an observatory time keeping certificate.

34:08 That is another example of doing the as much work as possible for the customers we we talked a lot about the last two weeks for for Steve Jobs. Hans is doing the same thing. He just makes it your decision easier. Oh, okay. Oh, I want a precise uh obviously you want a precise wristwatch. Oh, these are the most precise? Okay, cool. That makes my d my buying decision so much easier. And so that is in nineteen fourteen. Now he wanted the the second part. He's got the three part. He's like, I want to be precise, I want to be waterproof, I want to be self winding.

34:32 And so this goes back to what I told you about. One of the most important things to understand about Hans is the fact that he understood the opportunity better than anybody else. And he would invest heavily in developing the technology. to bring his ideas to fruition. And that means He didn't have to invent him himself. He would buy the inventions

34:47 of other watchmakers. And then combine their ideas with his efforts. And look at how fast he would move. So there's two inventors. They're in Switzerland. They file they file a Swiss patent. And they create the world's first waterproof seal for a wristwatch. The patent is granted and published on

35:04 May nineteen twenty six. Hans buys the po patent. In July. Two months sixty days later, he already owns the patent. And what does that mean? He owns the patent, so of course, now this new innovation is only ex it's exclusive to Rolex watches. You see how he's stacking one advantage over another?

35:21 He's like, Hey, we have the most accurate Best watching the world. Here's proof. Oh, now we have this new technology. Guess who owns the patent? We do, you can only get it here. And so this is the creation of the oyster watch, which still the oyster classification is waterproof.

35:34 And so in his autobiography, he's laying out like this is all the problems I had to solve, and this is why I had to solve them in sequential order, and how once they're solved. gives me just an unfair advantage that no one else has. So he says on looking back into the past, I find that in developing and extending my business. I've always had certain aims in mind. This course from which I never deviated.

35:54 Keep the main thing the main thing is what he's saying. Perhaps these aims can be summarized as follows. Number one. I have to create watch design suitable for both men and women. Done. Number two, I have to standardize a range of movements of different sizes. Done. Number three, to obtain a high degree of quality That our watches, whatever the calibre caliber, should be recognized as chronometers by the observatories. That's the Q

36:15 Uh certificate. Done. Next one to maintain this high degree of precision By protecting the movements against the penetration of dust and impurities. the danger to which the wristwatch is particularly exposed, and that was why he needed this This pattern.

36:31 This waterproof seal that proved so important. It's gonna unlock his ability to do the perpetual in a minute, but he talks about he tells us in his own words. Why this is so important. This last point presented a problem. Which could only be resolved by protecting the movement against all outside influences. To my technical assistance, my refrain, my constant refrain was from the very earliest days. We must succeed in making a watch case so tight.

36:55 That our movements will be permanently guaranteed against d damage caused by dust. Water, heat, and cold. Only then will the perfect accuracy of the Rolex be secured. Why am I reading this all to you? Because he's gonna tell us why this is so important. This seemingly insolvable problem has been solved.

37:14 The waterproof case was finally created in nineteen twenty six. This invention was applied exclusively to To the Rolex watch. The fact is, like an oyster, it can remain an unlimited time underwater without detriment to its parts. The name Rolex Oyster

37:31 has become famous throughout the world. And I love that he said that the name becomes famous because it sets up for the next part. How did the name become famous? Well, remember, Hans is a gift marketer. He takes an event and he's gonna do this multiple times. He takes an event that's already getting a lot of attention and inserts his product and therefore amplifies and leverages that existing attention. And so there was a secretary named Mercedes who had swam the English channel before. She was doing it again. He hears about this.

37:59 So he's like, Okay, wear a Rolex oyster around your neck. And so she goes for another attempt. This time she actually fails. She I think she's she gets uh like ten hours and then her there's like muscle cramps or something like that. But the fact is no one since you'd already done it, that was like kind of irrelevant to the story. Because it's still being covered, the fact that she was in these freezing cold water in November swinging the English channel.

38:19 And that the Rolex was around her neck. It survived and kept perfect time for the entire 10 hours and even after the fact of when she was swimming the channel. So what does he do? He takes that, it's been covered, and then he runs this gigantic ad. And he has a great line when he describes it. He says that they found the wash was still running as perfectly as it had as if it had never left dry land. And so he says the event caused a sensation at the time for their waterproof watch was still unknown to the general public. On November twenty seventh, nineteen twenty seven, I reserved the front page of the Daily Mail.

38:48 Newspaper at a cost of a ton of money. For an ad proclaiming the success Of the first waterproof watch. This was the first step in the triumphant rise of the fame. of the Rolex oyster.

39:00 But look at how fast he moves. So this is invented in May nineteen twenty six. He buys it in July. nineteen twenty six. The next year he takes advantage of this news event, this you know, this event that's gonna get a ton of idea uh eyes on it anyways. Amplifies his product. That same year, nineteen twenty seven, he goes and creates these window displays in all of the retailers that are now going to sell his watch. And so this is how he describes it. We devised special window displays that which gave the buying public great pleasure.

39:28 The chief feature was an aquarium. With other plants and goldfish and in it was plunged An oyster watch. Which was the only watch in the world that was as watertight as an oyster. The same year he gets one of the top British actresses.

39:43 And the he starts running ads. The vr the ad is one of the top British act actresses, her hand is in like a goldfish bowl. So half of her arm is in a tank and then you could see that she's wearing a watch. And so he'll use this idea over and over again. And one of the things that Rolex does is it's p phenomenal. It's like they always associate themselves with the very, very best. So Another British guy named Malcolm Campbell. He broke like the land speed record in a car.

40:08 Like nine different times. And the last time that he did it. Hans learns that Malcolm had been wearing a Rolex when he broke the speed record. And so then he starts publicising, he starts running ads broadcasting that during this record breaking land speed attempt. The driver was wearing a Rolex. So Hans is doing this in the nineteen twenties. He does this until he dies. He does this over and over again.

40:30 He wanted to place Rolex watches on the wrist of Аз мене хай профал піпо like extreme achievers. He would go around and identify these of these leaders or these high achievers. And he would gif them Rolexes and then they'd be photographed W wearing them. Winston Churchill.

40:45 uh Dwight D. Eisenhower before and during that he w uh be got elected to the present the American presidency? And keep in mind he's giving these watches to Churchill and Joy T. Eisenhower. This is post World War Two. He's aiming straight to the top, the the you know, the greatest leaders in World War II. There's an actual ad that's run around this time that was excellent. The the the tagline is Men who guide the destinies of the world. Where Rolex watches.

41:09 Chuck Yeager, the pilot who broke the sound barrier for the very first time, he was wearing a Rolex watch. That was an ad. The expedition that first summited Mount Everest. Some of the people on the team were wearing Rolexes the same year. they get to the deepest level. Uh another team went to the like the the at the time the deepest level. uh that a human had gone to in the sea, I think it was like ten thousand or twelve thousand feet underneath.

41:30 And so they run an ad from the top of the world to the bottom of the sea? Rolex proves dependable. But this constant positioning of Rolex is the very top. We are only associated with the very best. You go and look at these taglines.

41:41 He would say over and over again, Rolex, the masterpiece of watch craftsmanship. Sold exclusively by quality jewelers. So I'll come back to the ads because I really think the ad studying the advertising and marketing of Hans, like he he was a legit geni genius in this domain, but I wanna I'll come back to that. I wanna go back to that third Pillar that he was trying to do. So he starts off with number one. I want the watches to be precise. He's done that.

42:03 Number two, I want them to be waterproof. He's done that. Now he says I want them to be self winding. Which he's gonna call perpetual. And so not only is this an example of him him having to solve another lot longstanding problem, but it is another example of something that pops up in the books that you and I talk about the fact that opportunity unlocks more opportunities in the future. So he talks about in his autobiography is like listen. The creation of the perpetual watch, whose movement is self winding and guaranteed to run without interruption.

42:29 This idea of course had preoccupied Many famous Herologists of the past. I am not a watch guy. I don't own any watches. My wife has a hard enough time getting me to wear a wedding ring. I'm very minimalist, right?

42:42 So I didn't know what the hell that word was. So I looked it up. All that is is a horologist is just a person or a company that makes or repairs Clocks and watches are also referred to throughout history as a clockmaker. So what Hans is telling us is like listen, this is not I wasn't the first co person to notice this is a problem.

42:58 I was the first person to solve it. And I wouldn't have been able to solve it if I didn't solve the waterproofing first. He said the waterproof watch. had in itself marked a great step forward towards the realization of this new achievement. An automatic watch can function with the utmost regularity only If the movement is placed in a waterproof case.

43:17 What he's telling is oyster unlock the opportunity for perpetual. It had been my belief that the watch of the future is the perpetual watch, in other words, The automatic or self-winding watch. In this field too, Rolex has been a pioneer. Without the waterproof watch. The perpetual could never have been discovered.

43:34 And so I need to repeat that'cause it's so important. Without the waterproof watch The perpetual could never have been discovered. Now something's also interesting. This is like a centuries old problem. They're gonna run a fantastic ad talking about like about how they solve this this century old problem. And there's a great line that I found in this Rolex blog that talks about that. He says Inventing the automatic wristwatch. That could wind itself was the dream of the ages.

43:56 In the watch world for centries. Many famous watchmakers. had tried to perfect the automatic or self winding watch, but none were successful. There's an important principle here for it that you and I can apply to our own work and the fact that it the more work that you do for the customer, The the the the easier you can make for c the customer

44:14 the greater the market can be. So before I read this section about why this was so important. Because you know, why constantly whining a watch is a pain in the ass. It's Not convenient. It's not as convenient as a perpetual watch. Steve Jobs put this best when he was talking about the difference of, you know, this hobbyist culture in the early like personal computer industry. And he says, My vision was to create the first fulgaged computer. We were no longer aiming for the handful of hobbyists.

44:40 Who like to assemble their own computers. who knew how to buy transformers and keyboards. For every one of them. There were a thousand people. who would want the machine to be ready to run.

44:52 In other words, if we can make this easier, we can expand the market by a thousand. Turns out he drastically under Underestimated that. Probably expanded. The market by Ten million or a hundred million or whatever the crazy number is.

45:05 And so when Rolex creates this perpetual automatic watch it eliminates the need to ever wind a watch again. And so they run this incredible ad that the headline is Master Horologist's Dream Is Realized a hundred and four years after his death, and it tells The history of This guy in theory

45:23 had invented the v world's first self winding watch, but h what he actually made was imperfect in practice. And now us, Rolex, the only watch company in the world, has perfected Yeah, they they they they essentially honor him. They say he was a great watchmaker, maybe, you know, maybe the greatest ever. And now his dream is finally realized 104 years after his death, and it was realized by Rolex. Oh, by the way, do you want one? And then right before Hans dies, he gives this interview.

45:51 And I found a transcript that was translated from French. And I think he does a wonderful job summarizing the impact that his sixty year career. had on the industry that he in large part created. I entered the watch business as a young man at nineteen years of age. That was sixty years ago.

46:09 When wrist watches didn't exist. Wrist watches for men didn't exist at all. Men wore pocket watches. Which went from father to son and son to grandson. And the opportunity for the watch industry to grow was extremely limited as sales were very slow.

46:24 As a young man I understood it would be very difficult to obtain results in an industry. That had little chance to make lots of money. Watches were cheap and the quality was not very good. Especially since There was no factory able to produce small watches.

46:39 Which was necessary for wearing them on your arm. The wrist watch. Was the піque of my career. As I foresaw the total development of the wristwatch. For the Swiss watch industry.

46:51 I can say I was one of the initiators in the whole watch industry. I was not only the first to understand the potential of the wrist watch. But I also made personal efforts. Which contributed largely

47:05 Of the industry. I think it's absolutely incredible to be able to hear the words of somebody had six decades of experience in this industry. And then the last idea. I wanna leave you with I think speaks to just how unique Hans and his story.

47:21 Truly is. In nineteen forty four, Hans set up the Hans Wilsdorf Trust. Which owns and controls Rolex to this day. He brilliantly set up the bylaws of his trust so Rolex could never be sold or made public. So we would never have to worry about catering to anything but making timeless watches.

47:39 If you think about it, this means Hans's vision is still very much alive and being executed. On a daily basis, despite the fact That he passed away more than half century ago. How many people can you think of? Де билди ворл клас бізнес.

47:54 And fifty years after they pass away. The company keeps going. As if they were still running it. And that is where I'll leave it. As far as buying the book, there's I can only find one copy available. It's like five hundred dollars.

48:09 But there is a series of other sources that I use for this podcast that I highly recommend. I'll link all these Rolex enthusiast blogs, which I thought were fantastic. I also use subjects or ideas rather from the book The Luxury Strategy, which I highly recommend. It reads like a textbook, I uh but it's actually fascinating. The subtitles Break the Rules of Marketing to Build Luxury Brands. I'll probably do an episode on it. Uh in the future. And then of course what I would do now is listen to that business breakdowns episode on Rolex called Timeless Excellence.

48:35 It covers the history of Rolex, but also how they operate the business in present day. It'll blow your mind. So I will leave that link down below, or you can just search business breakdowns rolex and it'll come up in your podcast player. That is three hundred and fifty one books down, one thousand go. And I'll talk to you again soon. I have a few quick updates before you go. If you're an existing subscriber to Founders Notes, you got a new feature, a new feature was added for you this week. I actually combined the founders AMA private podcast feed with founders notes.

49:02 So make sure that you log into Founders Notes and grab your personal private podcast feed. You'll find 50 short episodes waiting for you. I am likely renaming that private feed. to sage advice because The private podcast feed is going to be updated with new episodes. And all the episodes that I'm making for that private feed. Are gonna be really short and focused. on one topic. These are gonna be extremely concise, much more scripted than like a normal founders episode ever is.

49:31 I want them focused on one thing. So it could be like a subject, like leadership. How did history's greatest founders think about leadership, for example, or about like a person, like the best ideas of James Dyson, for example. So you'll find instructions on how to easily set up your private feed when you log into founders notes. And so there's an idea. I want to tell you my thinking about this, how my thinking about this has been influenced by some of the books that I've been reading and obviously the podcasts that I've been making. And so over the last few weeks and including the Rolex episode that you just heard, this idea that each product should have a single idea that ex is expressed clearly that describes why somebody should care. always written from the point of view of the person using the product. It the the the single ID express clearly should describe what the product does for them. And that two part series on Steve Jobs I just covered is like a master class in that.'Cause he was one of the best in the world.

50:19 Ever at doing this. And he did it intentionally. There's been a lot of quotes in those episodes where he's like, No, you have to work start with the customer and then work backwards. And you see how much time and effort he took into just editing his thinking, just making sure that he had the single idea expressed clearly. We see Hans Wilsorf was the same thing, where he's just like, Well, what was the most important thing for that he wanted to convey to his customers. He's like, we have the most precise watches in the world. They're waterproof, so you don't have to worry about exposing them to elements because they're not in your pocket anymore and they're on your arm. And they're perpetual. They're automatic. You never have to wind it. And then he just constantly drilled down and perfected on those three ideas decade after decade after decade. And you fast forward fifty, sixty years after he died, and Rolex is one of the most pri most valuable private companies in the world.

51:02 And so of course the entire reason that Founders Podcast exists is so we can use we can learn from history space entrepreneurs. Realize hey, these these in in Hans's case, he worked for six decades. Turns out over six decades you come up with some good ideas and then take those principles and hopefully apply to what we're doing. So I think I've really narrowed that down and I'll keep working on it, but like why does founders' notes exist? Like why the hell Th this is a private internal tool that I've been using for years. Why would I externalize that? And make it available to other people. Like what why would you care about that? And the reason is also embedded in the main reason that founders podcasts exist, because Charlie Munger hits on it just like Charlie Munger, just like almost every single person you and I cover, they all spent their very valuable time. These are some of the wealthiest people in the world, spent their very valuable time studying and learning from great people that came before them. Why? And Charlie Munger said best. He said that learning from history is a form of leverage.

51:50 And Founders Notes gives you the superpower to do this on demand. Founders Podcast is a fantastic tool to learn from history, but it's pushed to you. Founders notes give you the ability to control it. It gives you the ability to tap into that collective knowledge of issues entrepreneurs when you need it. And that's why I think it's valuable for you to have access to this giant searchable database of all my notes, all my highlights, all my transcripts. So if the single idea expressed clearly for Founders Notes overall is hey, learning from history is a form of leverage, Founders Notes gives you the superpower to do this on demand. What is

52:21 The single idea expressed clearly. Why does Sage this new private podcast feed? Why does Sage advice need to exist? In other words, what am I selling? And the more I thought about it, it's like, Oh, I I'm selling time. Because what I'm going to do with this private podcast feed that is now included with your subscription and founders' notes is I'm going for a maximum.

52:40 Insight. to time ratio. I love this idea that you could have an entrepreneur that spends Let's say forty years building their company, I can then spend forty hours reading and researching. Their life and career. And then distill that for you.

52:56 Down. Let's say ten minutes. 10 minutes of audio that you can do on demand. Download those ideas into your brain while your eyes are busy. So that is my North Star, that is my goal. As as with everything else, as my uh thinking evolves, I will keep you updated. If you do not yet have a subscription to Founders Notes, And you are spending hours and hours listening to the podcast, I highly recommend that you subscribe, and you can do so by going to Founders Notes. That's Founders Notes with an S.

53:22 Founders, notes. Dot com. And the second thing that I want to tell you about is this founders event that I'm hosting July twenty ninth through the thirty first. In Scots Valley, California. It is this beautiful venue deep in the California Redwoods. And the single idea expressed clearly around why. Do these events need to exist? It's because I wanna help high value people build relationships with each other.

53:45 I did this back at the first founders event. In uh March in Austin and I'm doing it again July twenty ninth through the thirty first in Scots Valley, California. And I'm doing this event in partnership with my friend Rick and Paul. They're the founders of Seder Grove, which is this five hundred million dollar permanent holding company. They're also the hosts of this podcast called Art of Investing. But the reason I'm partnering with these guys is because they are world class

54:09 At building relationships. They understand the direct link. between building relationships and value creation. And I know this because I know them personally as friends, and I talk to them all the time. But you can also see this if you just you can see this publicly. Look at their podcast feed. If you go to Art of Investing's podcast feed, they listen to the one that they just did with Mitch Rails. Mitch Rails is the co founder of Den Hair. He is one of the greatest living entrepreneurs and investors on the earth today. In his forty year career, Mitch had never given a single long form interview.

54:39 And he chose to do his very first one, which you can listen to as a podcast. with two of his most trusted collaborators and friends, somebody he speaks to multiple times a week, that is Rick and Paul. Rick and Paul were at the first founders event in March. Multiple people that were at that event met them And have since built relationships with them. They he they did not know who Rick and Paul were before they went to the founders event in March. And I've heard from multiple people that are now calling, texting, zoom getting on Zoom, going in person and meeting and spending time with Rick and Paul because they're learning from Rick and Paul how to build a permanent capital holding company.

55:10 One of the breakout sessions that we're gonna have at this event on July twenty ninth and the thirty first is going to be led by Rick and Paul. They're going to talk about How to build a new investment firm, a new permanent capital holding company and how established firms can actually sustain excellence. Way before they were doing this, way before they founded their own company. They had studied and helped hundreds of the world's greatest investors. They literally wrote case studies on some of these. They wrote an incredible case study on one of the greatest compounders of all time, which is Julian Robertson of Tiger Management. And by going and looking at their podcast feed, you can see some of the people they develop these really good relationships, like Todd Combs from Berkshire, Ho my friend Ho Nam from Altos Ventures. Relationships run the world. And I think Rick and Paul are a great illustration of that.

55:50 I think there's session, I think the entire event will be hugely valuable for any investor. There's a ton of founders coming, there's investors, there's executives coming, but specifically if you are interested in developing a new investment firm. and learning more lessons from established firms that sustained excellence over multiple decades, highly recommend coming to the event and making sure you don't miss The breakout session taught by Rick and Paul. Another thing I want to mention to you about these events that's really important is they're all inclusive. That means if you get yourself to the event, you don't have to worry about anything else. I ran out the entire venue. Every single person, there's nobody else that's on the property that's not part of the event. So every single person, if you attend,

56:24 Every single person you see there is there for the same reason as you. That person has the same interests. They're their fellow business nerds. We're all business nerds. And so that's why we gathered together. Again, that is July 29th. Through the thirty first, it's a private venue deep in the California Redwoods. It is beautiful. And the reason that it exists, again, that single idea expressed clearly that you and I have been talking about for the last few weeks that I don't think I'll ever forget. Why does this exist? This exists to help you build relationships with other high value people. And that is important because that opens up opportunities in the future that you can never possibly predict.

56:55 So I hope you come to this event and build relationships with other founders listeners, other high value people. The first thing you need to do if you want to attend, you go to founders podcast. Dot com. forward slash events and apply. And that's it for me. Thank you very much for listening. Thank you very much for the extra support. And I'll talk to you again soon.

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